| Description | Interview with George Fraser recorded at his home on 12 June 1997 by John Hargreaves.
Transcript of Interview :
H Mr Fraser we are not going to repeat the fascinating story of your journalistic career for which you've given interviews elsewhere, I just want to try and recall some what you can of your career at the university. I notice that the academic year when you enrolled began on the 1st of October 1914, two months after the outbreak of war. I wonder if you can recall anything of the mood of the university and of Aberdeen at that time?
F As far as I can remember, the point that I would have to make right away, is that I didn't stay in town and much of the ordinary university life passed me by unfortunately. I did travel daily and got the train at Kinaldie where my father was station master and came off at Kittybrewster, walked down Bedford Road to King's, and started up there. Part of my training of course involved going to Marischal College as well and it was a case of chasing, running sometimes, and getting there as fast as possible. One of the helpful ways the professors had, they would let us out from a King's College class five minutes early and we were allowed to go but most of the time was spent getting there as fast as possible. There was no direct communication. The bus was down in King Street, I shouldn't say bus I should say tram, was down in King Street and by the time you went down you had missed it probably and you found that the easier way was just to get there on foot as fast as you can. I did tell the story once, and I think you probably have it in your records, of how in one of our classes was a Chinaman who had a motorbike and sidecar and he loaded as many people as he could onto this affair much to the consternation of many of the people. The women in the streets would wave because he was a pretty wild driver and we used to travel that way backwards and forwards and that was a helpful thing. That was our method of getting from place to place.
H I haven't heard that story. I wonder if that was the, there was a Chinese student about that time who became the father-in-law of Mao-Tse-Tung later on but I don't know whether it was he.
F There were two Chinamen. One I think became very high up in the [state in China] he was mostly in Switzerland but this one …
H Foong Kong Chen, the name comes back to me now …
F … That was how we moved from class to class.
H I was asking about the general reaction to the war. Many of you, including no doubt yourself, must have wondered whether it was going to make a difference to your studies?
F The point was that I didn't have to go to either war. Largely because I'd had a very serious illness round about the turn of the century. A serious epidemic of [?] and other things broke out at that time causing havoc with medical arrangements all over the North East. The result was the normal hospital facility just couldn't cope and in our case we were treated at home. My father was station master at Drum at the time. The kitchen happened to have two old fashioned box beds we called them inset in the wall. Into one bed I was put and my elder brother. My two sisters were in the other bed. That was four of us. The question arose as to what to do with the baby in the cradle and I always remember Dr Crannie from Culter, Crannie was his name, he considered and his conclusion was, he'll take it anyway, put him in with the rest. My father had to retire to a different part of the house using a different door and of course he was to be more in touch with the public and that was practically the only precaution there was that we wouldn't spread the thing. The funny side to me was that the only means of preventing anything wrong passing from one part of the house to another was a white sheet was hung over the door and that was the protection we had then and how things carried on from there. It was a long weary period the result was that I was left with a very weak heart. It had its funny side. If I could mention just two little incidents with the doctor. He was a very fine man, delightful man. I was getting fed up you see and he said 'what are you girning at?', and I said 'I'm fed up, I want to get up', well he said 'what's hindering you, up you get' so I crawled over, got on my feet and collapsed amongst his feet. Well he said 'you'll bide in yer bed, and stay there and I'll let you up when I tell you can get up'. And another little one was, I think round about that time I must have been one of the first to get the antitoxin [?] I always remember him taking out a little box, a wooden box, and opening it and taking this dangerous looking instrument out, he looked up and he says 'this will hurt a bit', of course consternation, but he says 'if he dinna skirl I'll gie ye a penny'. I won my penny.
H I think we do forget how precarious the health of many students was at that time. I suppose in a way the war was an additional hazard?
F They couldn't get the medical facilities you see. Now the difficulty in the classroom and the thing that hurt me most of all, I had volunteered to go to the war, of course I got rejected each time, and every now and again we were called up again and sometimes in the class a fellow student, my name would be called up, my fellow student would be called up, but I knew I wouldn't be taken. It was my worry, sorrow for this fellow and the tragedy was even after when I became a journalist one of my main jobs was to handle statistics, deaths, people killed and I would see the names of some of those students coming in. That was very, very hard to bear.
H You must have felt a difference between 1914 when nobody knew how long the war would last, and 1917 when there cannot have been too many men of your age left?
F When the University Company was called up a different set came in but you didn't know how long they would be there. There was always the chance they would be called up. I remember Professor Jack in English, reading the war statements he was almost crying when he called out the names, he was very, very sentimental about these things. So that was that and then it was just a matter of getting to know the different professors at the time and little stories that used to be told about them
H Well do tell us some. I've got some of their names down here.
F If I know anything about anyone in particular?
H You've already mentioned Professor Jack.
F Well one story about him which I may have told the university already was, he was working in his garden, it was very hot, and somebody, a ragged looking man, stopped on the way and asked for something and Jack the kindliest of men, just hadn't been in the right mood he said 'go away don't bother me'. He told us this in the classroom and he said he got an astonishing reply from this man who drew himself up and in a cultured voice said 'things are alright for you now, they may not always be so'. That just about broke his heart. There was a story that was told about MacDonald of course, in Maths, you've probably heard it. It was about two students who hadn't an earthly chance of being allowed to sit their exam of course and they decided to go and visit him at home and one would go in first and consult MacDonald about it and see if he could persuade him. So one did go in and apparently he got round MacDonald's heart pretty well, as he told him what it would mean to his parents and all this sort of thing and he played his case very well and he said 'by the way what percentage had you in your class?', he said 'I'm afraid it wasn't very good, I had 10%' 'Oh my,' said MacDonald, 'that's pretty low, 'oh well' he said 'I'll make an exception I'll let you go, OK'. So he went out, of course, and told the other chap what had happened and he came in and tried the same old game with MacDonald and came the percentage and he said 'what was your percentage?' 'I'm sorry it was 9%'. 'No, no' he said 'we must draw the line somewhere'. I suppose you've heard it before?
H I think I have yes. MacDonald was …
F A very kind man.
H Is it true he had a rather hard exterior?
F Yes.
H You didn't need that indulgence. Did you find him a good teacher?
F He was a good teacher, yes. I don't know if you've ever heard of Goodwillie?
H I've heard the name, yes.
F He ultimately lived along here. He had a strange way of raising his voice at the end of every sentence, the result was in the classroom every student whooped like that. He was a very, very clever mathematician but away beyond our understanding and all sorts of things. I always remember a student from the back 'canny, canny he says, you'll be oot at the door ?'.
H But MacDonald was clear was he?
F Yes, he was a very good man, a kind man. There was a bit of a dispute going on between two aspects of the university. Now Soddy was the famous chemist he was on the side of science of course and Baillie who went away to Leeds, he was on the philosophy side and it was a case of sharing the money the University could afford and each thought the other was getting more than he should be and the funny thing is it got into our lectures and part of the lecture was Baillie making his case out as clearly as he could and then we would go to the other class and got the other side of the question. I don't know how it all settled up but it went on quite a while and it occupied quite a bit of time of the lectures much to our delight I may say.
H Were they personal?
F They weren't nasty, it was just each man trying to make the best case he could for the money for his side of the business.
H That is quite a familiar situation.
F One of the professors … but he was very absent-minded. He had been walking from Marischal to King's and on the way he seemed to develop a limp and he came in and he started to explain to the class about this limp, what had happened was he had had one foot on the pavement and one foot in the gutter. That's the story that was told, whether it's true or not. Have you anybody else in mind?
H Did you find any particular teacher particularly inspiring?
F I liked Jack, very much so. At the time it was Sir George Adam Smith.
H Yes, I was going to ask you how much you saw of the Principal.
F He didn't actually cap me it was Huntly, I think he was on duty that day but I always remember Sir George meeting us at the door and saying 'behave yourselves lads.' An interesting side story to that is, my son he did military service before university and the officer he had in the army and doing his training was Wavell's son. Wavell once came here actually …
H Yes, while he was rector?
F Yes. He told a story about how his father had read Sir George's book and how this had helped him and Allenby to at least beat the Turks. And this one was killed, he went back. George was put into the army training squad seeing as he was going to be a student, I think, to do part of his service and it came to a period when would have to go abroad somewhere. Well George was most anxious to get to Nairobi because he wanted to climb Kilimanjaro because a friend of his had tried and failed while in the army and he asked Wavell how he could get there. Wavell said 'at least Kenya's East Africa' and Wavell said 'well ask to be sent to East Africa - to West Africa sorry - and that's exactly what happened. He went out and managed to get this chance, he did climb it.
H He did, good, yes.
F And that's why … Wavell used to go, this was Viscount Keren he was then, the son, he used to go to King's Cross station at nights just to see if any of his old boys from the Black Watch, this part of the world would happen to be passing through. We got a phone call - I'm drifting here - the first thing that Keren said he was sent down to Bournemouth where he was charge of education side 'anybody play golf?', and my son actually played for the university - afterwards - 'yes' he said 'oh, well, be prepared' the next thing was a phone call asking George for the golf clubs to be sent on, so he spent the greater part of his training down in Bournemouth playing golf with Viscount Keren … [background noise]
H Otherwise Principal Adam Smith, of course would be quite old already?
F He was old, but a very, very nice man. We invited him once, after I became a journalist and he told us the story of some of his training in Germany he acted as correspondent, actually as a journalist for The Times or some of these papers so he claimed himself to be a journalist but he was very fine.
H Professor J Arthur Thomson, I've been looking up your class list, and you must have done several classes with him. What sort of impression did he leave on you as a teacher?
F Thomson was - it's very difficult to say - they used to say you knew in advance, if you had your father's notes. That's the story they told 'joke here' and that sort of thing. He was interesting. Now was it Thomson or was it in the Nat. Phil. class we were shown what he claimed to be the first use of wireless because he made a bell ring at the other end of the bench …
H And you just mentioned Professor Baillie disputing with Professor Soddy, do you have memories of his teaching?
F Yes, he was always very, very interesting and again at that stage a little beyond us … I think that's the most I can say.
H The other person you mentioned was Professor Soddy, but before we talk about him, I came across something today which surprised me a bit. You graduated in July 1917 and then I find that you did two classes in chemistry after that?
F Yes, that is quite true. I had the thought of going on to the University of London but what I had always at the back of mind, my parents weren't very wealthy and I thought the sooner I really got earning for myself was … and I did actually start as you say but I finally cancelled that.
H You had thoughts of doing a BSc?
F Yes that's right. I'd just got an ordinary MA, intending all the time to be a teacher, just a country teacher. Evening training for that I always remember at Inverurie Academy where I got my Highers I was what they call a junior student and a rule, as far as I remember, was that you took your Highers, you had to take your Highers in your last year, you had to do the sixth year as it were. So it happened that I took mine in the fifth year and qualified for university entrance then but stayed on and under this regulation if ever I was going to be a teacher and do my bit at the training centre as well as university. I took, I don't know if it was mercifully or … a terrible dose of flu and I wasn't able to sit this, however they accepted my fifth year passes. But I changed the system and went straight to the university. With the junior student system you see we had so many classes simultaneously … training centre - you would know more about that it was something of that nature but everybody knows the story about me walking down the street, Union street. I don't know if you knew Alex Keith at all?
H I met him once yes
F The university gave him a doctorate - actually Alex should have got the editorship - he resigned over a fairly bad piece of work, which I know about, my heart went out to him. We were very friendly. We travelled, he from Kintore and I from Kinaldie, it was the station nearer Aberdeen.
H On the same train?
F On the same train.
H When he was a student or was he already a journalist?
F He was a student the year ahead of me. He graduated the year before me but he went on for Honours. And it was just a chance that I met him in Union Street and he mentioned, that was about October, and he joined the staff of the Journal in January of that year.
H There must have been quite a community of students on that train sometimes? You filled up a few carriages?
F I didn't quite get that?
H Were there several carriages filled with students when you travelled on the train?
F Some came from as far as Huntly on the train. It made for a long day. We were equally bad going to Inverurie Academy, had to leave by train at half past seven in the morning and arrive there long before the school opened and then - I have all that written there, if that's what you want.
H Another thing I noticed, when you enrolled in the Science Faculty in 1917, you gave an address in Aberdeen, in Caledonian Place.
F I stayed with an uncle there, he was a brother of my mothers.
H But it was still war time?
F Right away I was shoved on to district news, awful stuff it was, we had to get it into some sort of shape. It's space Paper was short and things had been curtailed and cut down it grew very, very difficult, the copy we handled was, Reuters was on the business end and Press Association, that all the national news and the foreign news came via the Post Office by wire, hand-written out on a flimsy sort of paper and as it came in it started at the top of the paper, basically there was a fire somewhere or other and half way down it transferred into maybe sports results or something about the war and there was 203 of us in the office at that time and there was a paste pot, a gum brush and a scissors and we had to cut this up and shove it on … so that was the way - very primitive
H Just to go back to the chemistry class and Professor Soddy, now it's interesting you should say he was competing with the Faculty of Arts because he became very interested in Economics and I remember my own father had been very keen much later on what Soddy wrote about the theory of money. Were you conscious, what sort of impression did Soddy make on you as a man?
F Yes, I was rather fond of Soddy, maybe more so - I didn't know very much about the other man - but Soddy seemed to be down to earth with us more than the other one was very much a 'dude' he was very, very dressy and that sort of thing, he appealed to the law students about us.
H And Soddy got you interested in chemistry? If you hadn't met Alexander Keith you might have gone on …?
F Yes I felt after all this wasn't fair because I still had a sister to educate. She became a Certificated Teacher. Actually she's still alive, she's 98 and lives near Johannesburg and I phoned by chance two days ago and learned that she'd just had a bad accident and fallen.
H Your family seems to have survived the epidemic very well indeed.
F Well the two of us did, the two middle ones. The two who had a better education. It turned out that way, it had nothing to do with … it just turned out that way. She was in schools up and down the country then she married and landed in Africa Gold Coast at first and from there to [?] and she ended up in Johannesburg. Her husband died two years ago, but there she is. Her descendants are in New Zealand and America.
H Was she an Aberdeen graduate?
F No, she went to the Training Centre right from school, what they call a Certificated Teacher. We were the middle of the family.
H Well Mr Fraser, I see that journalism's gain may have been the loss of the world of education. Thank you very much indeed for sharing these memories.
F It was exciting in journalism, you felt you were in the heart of things and especially during the war, both wars. I was there, handling the armistice in each case. We were celebrating fifty years of the landings in Normandy and I happened to be the first in and I got the message saying the British and American troops had crossed the Channel and were moving on and I remember one editor - I was chief sub-editor - I remember phoning the editor and telling him and he said 'I think you've got this wrong' and I said, 'I'm afraid it's true.' I think the government or the military authorities had put out a false message that the intention was to land the following day …
H They put it out to the press?
F They told it in secret to the press, and I'm afraid he was taken in.
H That's very interesting, thank you very much.
End of Interview
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